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Interview

"...,we have been able to give a foundation to the activities of the Human Rights Commission."-Justice Ranganath Misra
***Today one can clearly discern a trend in many countries in various regions of the globe of establishing national human rights commissions to take care of the promotion and protection of human rights. It is as if these commissions are a well prescribed general panacea for all the human rights problems plaguing these countries. In fact it is a paradox of the modern state that it has become necessary for the state to create entities to ensure that it does not violate human rights. The Government of Bangladesh has also decided to set up a National Commission on Human Rights. It was in the wake of criticism of India for suppression of human rights that the President of India promulgated an Ordinance on September 28, 1993 with a view to providing for the setting up of a National Commission on Human Rights. Later on parliament embodied the provision of the Ordinance into the Protection of Human Rights Act 1993. Justice Ranganath Misra, the first Chairman of the National Commission on Human Rights of India, last week visited Dhaka with a view to sharing the experience of National Human Rights Commission with concerned Bangladeshi officials and NGO activists. In an exclusive interview Mr Ranganath Misra who was also the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of India, spoke with The Daily Star's Abul Hasnat Monjurul Kabir on the various aspects of the performance of the Human Rights Commission in India.***
Daily Star (DS): What is the purpose of your visit in Bangladesh this time?
Ranganath Misra (RM): 1 have come essentially to discuss with UNICEF, UNDP and the NGOs here as to how a Human Rights Commission can be set up in Bangladesh. For that purpose I had a meeting with the NGOs. a separate meeting with UNICEF people and tomorrow morning. I will meet UNDP people and also with some representatives of the Government of Bangladesh.
DS: You were the first Chairman of the National Human Rights Commission of India. How do you evaluate the performance of the Commission? Are you satisfied with its present trend of action?
RM: I was there for three years and one month as its first chairman. Im personally happy that we did something veiy positive and we have been able to give a foundation to the activities of the Human Rights Commission. A lot of things which may not have happened without the timely intervention of the Commission, have happened. The common man has now some perception of human rights. We have taken various programmes on human rights in the media and teaching on human rights has been started. So far as the police, the army or the defense personnel are concerned we have started teaching human rights for the inservice as a pre-service requirement. And the army, the BSF. other paramilitary forces and the state police have all been now acquainted with human rights and their obligation to conform to standard which is stated fn the Universal Declaration of Human Rights Any lapse is being seriously viewed. There have been instances where the police have been penalised, army officers have also been disciplinarily punished by prompt action. The common man In India seems to have developed the sense of confidence in the activities of the commission.
DS: The Government of Bangladesh has decided to set Sp a National Commission on uman Rights. What suggestions you want to put before the government for their consideration?
RM: That would depend upon what we will discuss tomorrow. At this moment I don’t want to disclose it.
DS: It has been observed by some quarters that the proposed National Human Rights Commission of Bangladesh should have a constitutional mandate. They prefer to set up the commission by a constitutional amendment rather than by a statutory decision so that it could be a part of the Constitution. What is your observation in this regard?
RM: in many countries, Human Rights Commissions are not the part of their Constitutions. In other words, their commissions have not any constitutional formation. A special statute can do it. In fact it depends upon how government and the people look at the commission and how far Is it able to perform. In Philippines, it's a constitutional commission. In one or two other coun-
tries. there is also similar provision. In South America. In two countries there Is a provi sion that they should be a part of their Constitutions. But ordinarily a standard legislation can be enough. If the people have support for It and the commission people show its respect to people s rights effectively. it is bound to perform well even without constitutional mandate.
DS: What did the Indian Human Rights Commission do to protect the human rights in Kashmir?
RM: Initially, the people of Kashmir did not come to us thinking that If they come to us. they would be accepting the Jurisdiction of the commission which is a governmental agency But as time passed and as they saw that we had taken some suo-mofu action without any complaint and the performance was to their satisfaction, gradually complaints came to us one after the other in regard to some army action in the valley We took serious steps which were accepted by all the people of Kashmir Thereafter quite a good number of complaints came. We recommended to Gov eminent of India that the valley should be opened to the visitors from the west and tourists should also be allowed to come. The International Red Cross should have its own Innings within the state. All these have been done in phases. And there fore in stabilising the conditions of Jammu and Kashmir and bringing about normalcy, the Commission played a major role.
DS: How did the controversial Terrorist and Disruptive Activities (Prevention) Act come to end?
RM: The Terrorist and Disruptive Activities (Prevention) Act. popularly known as TADA.
was such 4 legislation Which we found difficult to entertain because the ethos was contrary to the very concept of human rights. Our embarrassment was that Its vires was challenged In the Punjab High Court. The High Court had quashed the Act by saying that it was ultra vires the Constitution, the funda mental rights But the decision was reversed by the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court upheld the ulres of the statute. It was at that time that we had to handle TADA. Hundreds of complaints came before us from Jails that cases were not being found, they (the arrested per sons) were not being produced before the court as required by the Constitution and the Crim Inal Procedure Code (CrPC) and long dates were taken, they were not being disposed of In time. Once we started looking into these, we came to be satisfied that objections were valid And we therefore wanted more of TADA Court to be set up to hear TADA cases. We succeeded. In Bombay, in Delhi and in sev eral number places, a good number of courts were established on account of our intervention. But that itaelf was not enough. And then we found the Act was being applied to cases where TADA had no application. We therefore started intervening in a serious way When the Supreme Court upheld its vires we found that it was a temporary legislation, it was expiring on 23rd of May 1995 And the Government had already decided to put in a legislation to extend its perioa of life At that stage I wrote a letter Krsonally to each of the Mem-
rs of Parliament In the two Houses drawing their attention to the fact that this was really a violative of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and if this law was enforced, it would
be difficult for the Commission to help human rights situation towards a belter condition The response was excellent And ul tlmately government found it difficult to push their bill The Act lapsed They wanted another substitute legislation to come In We raised strong objection to that attempt also The government as a result, could not press for that initiative
That is how TADA came to an end
DS: Violation of prisoners' rights is a common phenomena in the jails of this subconti nent. Did you deal with this intricate issue of violation of human rights?
RM: Oh yesl I dealt with the violation of prisoners' rights several times. In fact there had been several instances where we first intervened. The first one was over-crowding. We started with the Tihar Jail which is the main jail in Delhi and with our Intervention arrangement for accommodation was expanded, new wards were set up and thus gradually the situation is improving.
We found that the facilities for medical treatment were not adequate. The number of prisoners in the jail would be about 3.800 but there was only one doctor and with our intervention the number of doctors became 16. Emergency facility (treatment facility at nighti vrae wanting We Insisted that there should tie three or four doctors living within the Jail area or very close to the Jai) so that they can be called any time necessary on emergency basts. That also was done
Then we wanted segregation of the children. We also wanted that men should not have access to the women s wards All that had been done very perfectly In Delhi Thereafter we wanted the jail officials to understand human rights That was also done Then we regulated the food and we ensured the maintenance of standard of food as normal rules of health and hygiene demand
After Tihar the overcrowding Issue was taken up for almost every Jail. We found the Prisoners' Act which was enforced was an Act of 1894. that Is about more than a century old (!) and was recommended to enforce at a time when India was not Independent and the British had made It to suit their colonial purpose. So we took the lead, we called all concerned state officials and ultimately with their assistance a draft legislation was prepared by us and we had already requested the state governments to accept it on principle so that a regular draft bill can be prepared Prisons are under states jurisdiction in India. We wanted central legislation so that there would be one common law for the whole country For that purpose. as the chairman. I re quested all the Chief Ministers to pass a resolution tn the state legislatures authorising parliament to legislate — as required by the Constitution of India. Many states have agreed, and the present commission is pursuing it. I expect that by end of this year, there would be a new law substituting the cen tury old colonial legislation.